"I’m going to aggressively call anyone talking about a widely known issue with American Healthcare a bullshit spewing liar!

Waaaah why am I being downvoted waaaah I fucking hate you socialists and your facts, you’re all ignorant dipshits even though you just proved I’m the ignorant one!"

As an American leftist, the above is the majority of my countrymen and it is fucking embarrassing and exhausting to live alongside them. It is incredibly frustrating how well our government has convinced the average person in this country to vehemently fight against their own wellbeing. The number of people I’ve come across who claim to be left politically but then call socialism the extreme right is just mind-boggling. It’s like they think other countries are just actual make believe and that the US is the only functional country on the planet

Aww, someone is grumpy that their weak attempt to make me seem like a violent racist backfired

Go back to reddit if you want to get mountains of upvotes for saying Kirk was a champion of the people. We don’t do fascism here.

I don’t need to, as we aren’t disagreeing. Same spirit, difference in phrasing. Everything is good, no need to infight

I’m not going to presume to know what a black man assassinated by white supremacists would think about his people still being murdered and treated as second class citizens for the color of their skin, and resurgence of racism in America just shy of 60 years after his tragic killing. Though I’d have to think he’d be appalled at how controversial it is to call for a swift end to those perpetrating it.

What I do know is Kirk is quoted saying that black people had unsufficent brain power to hold positions of leadership in society and that the civil rights movement was a mistake.

The fact that you think both of these people and their viewpoints deserve equal defense and respect says a lot more about you than it does me.

Prominent leftist ideology and writers don’t glorify gun ownership or turn them into identity pieces, but they absolutely do see their value for attaining and protecting rights. A lot more leftists own guns than people realize, they just don’t advertise it to threaten and intimidate like fascists do. Many of our rights and freedoms only came about because people were willing to actually fight for them. This is a famous Marx quote: Under no pretext should arms and ammunition be surrendered; any attempt to disarm the workers must be frustrated, by force if necessary.

There’s no putting the cat back in the bag, so we may as well regulate their access and provide education and training for their use before they can be owned, as well as how to effectively avoid their use in the case of defense, and mitigate the damage in the aftermath of their use.

“I’m a staunch ally of Kirk’s abuse victims. I just also happen to believe that Kirk deserved a long safe life without violence so that he could effectively develop the propaganda justifying their genocide!”

At worst, you’re a fascist agitator trying to stir the pot in a leftist space for entertainment. At best, you’re a whiny limp-dick centrist who will throw anyone under the bus to make yourself look like some holier than thou moralist. Either way you’re enabling the regime and I’d mourn your death about as much as I do Kirk’s

Guarantee you don’t spend anywhere near as much effort defending minorities, LGBTQ, or gun violence victims as you do white christo-nationalist terrorism advocates. Wonder why that might be.

Fuck off, you nazi defending piece of human garbage. Charlie Kirk deserved what he got and the only unfortunate parts about his death are how fast and painless it was, and that he isn’t around to see how quickly his nazi wife took his money and ran off to start fucking a dude with a fetish for duvet covers

Yep, defending minorities and calling out fascism is definitely smearing. Anything else stupid to say or are you running late for your klan rally?

This is who you’re choosing empathy for. Violent insurrectionists and pardoned felons who hide their faces, commit violence for the regime, and violate the sanctity of our rights. You can try to smear me all you want and claim I have no empathy, but it is blatantly clear I have much more than you. I staunchly defend persons of color, LGBTQ, women, children and many other targeted groups that the fascists want to put in concentration camps. I am willing to put my own safety and wellbeing at risk in their defense.

If you believe the fascists and their attack dogs deserve the same level of respect, empathy, and defense as the real victims in American society, you and I already know which side you’re fighting for.

We already know why. They’re cowards and collaborators who think they’ll get to sleep at the foot of the bed if they obey and throw the rest of us to the wolves. They think they’re noble and pious by sticking to the middle of the road, better than all of us. Who needs messy ethics and functional moral compasses when you can just claim you’re above all the “petty squabbling”.

Fascists only protect their own. Centrists are useful idiots and tools for the extreme right and always have been. They think they’re safe by staying “neutral”. What they refuse to understand is that they are on the purge lists like everyone else, they just aren’t as high up in priority as the rest of us.

Sickens me that people are upvoting this and think this way. Oh won’t someone think of the poor fascists. They need to provide for their families, so its okay for them to terrorize and kill indiscriminately.

These are not golden-hearted dimwits who just need to see the light. This is not a Disney movie with a villain redemption plot. These are fascists, do you understand what that means? They take pleasure in what they do because they think they are purging mutants and heathens for the greater good. The paychecks are a bonus. They are not using them to provide for their beaten children and raped spouses, they are using them to buy bigger guns to slaughter more “others”

You want to stay on the fence about fascism, go ahead. I can’t stop you, I’m just text on the internet. But you are doing tangible harm to real people in this world by trying to white wash what is happening and giving a pass to the people making it happen.

This dude is literally all over every post about this frothing at the mouth pissed and trying to call it fake news. Definitely a very lost fascist trying to cope in their tiny mind that their king likes the taste of baby batter.

Ooooh sweetie, no thank you. I appreciate the interest, but how about you ask deepthroat don instead?

If you thinking blowing someone is a phrase used to call someone a kiss ass, you are way too young to be on the internet unsupervised

King, it is okay. Take a breath. No one here is attacking anyone, just dispelling potentially harmful opinions. I know for a lot of people getting into fitness and going to the gym is intimidating, but it doesn’t have to be. I’ve had quite a few women and LGBT tell me that they read comments like yours online and don’t want to try working out, because they think everyone in the gym is Joe Rogan or Andrew Tate, and that they will be mocked or hurt. This is just not even close to reality.

Most people are just there for the love of the game or for the gains, that’s it. No one who takes their fitness seriously thinks it is just an easy way to trick women, I promise you.

Fitness is for everyone and should be made more accessible, not more intimidating or off-putting, its great and improves your life. There are plenty of people like me in the gym that would readily and happily help others at the drop of a hat, no strings attached.

I’ve literally never had a serious partner tell me that me lifting was a reason they wanted to be with me, period. To me this just sounds like a bizarre fanfic scenario you read.

Going to the gym for an hour a few days a week and running a few miles on off days isn’t an “obsession”, it’s just general fitness. I get one go around this rock and one body to do it with. Being fit makes the experience much better, and makes ME feel good about my body and the progress I’ve made, damned be anyone else’s opinion.

Radical concept, but not everyone in the gym is a roided out manosphere moron trying to slay pussy because of brainwashing.

I was in the CJ field for 10 years, which opened my eyes to a lot. I know you think “they’re fascists who ignore the law” is reductionist or untrue, but that is literally it. It is that simple. It is also not new, regular law enforcement in the US has been exactly like this for pretty much our entire history.

When you break the law, and you have powerful deeply ingrained cultures and institutions backing you that will look away or refuse to apply the law to you, then the law effectively does not exist. Laws are social contracts that are invented entirely by us, and literally do not exist if not enforced. The universe does not care. There is no karmic balance that steps in to even things out.

I think many are just ignoring this or trying to rationalize it some other way, because it is terrifying to come to terms with when you are told your entire life that these institutions, police and courts and laws and checks and balances, are in place to protect you. Law enforcement in the US has fascism and nationalism baked into its core, and most of them are actively wanting what ICE is doing. Many law enforcement are in their ranks or are assisting in ways that most people don’t even realize. And beyond that, the rest of our judicial and political systems are also being manipulated or just blatantly ignored to pave the way for this.

Ultimately the question being posed to the US at this point is, what happens when the people in power do not care or feel empathy, except for their own goals, and there is no sufficient opposition. There are no easy answers to this. When two opposing forces collide, one or the other has to give in some way. ICE has had basically zero consequences for their actions, despite how blatantly illegal and wrong they are. So far, their side is applying more force and it shows.

Just because you were ignorant and bought the propaganda doesn’t mean everyone has. The US has always been an imperialist bully built on rampant capitalism, nationalism, and a misguided self-image of being exceptional. Instead of whining and incorrectly projecting that everyone was as gullible as you, perhaps you should focus on asking others to help you understand the US and its place globally in history, so you are less susceptible to more propaganda.

If even a fraction of the general US population was willing or capable of recognizing the reality of what the US is and has done, we’d be much better equipped to deal with the situation we’re in. Instead, most choose to get indignant if you even dare to suggest they may be or were the bad guy at any moment ever.

“Fascism is hot and empowering when they have boobies haha”

You’re a fucking moron

As much as I wish it were the case, this is not even close to the only dem I’ve spoken to who is brainwashed into thinking that anything truly left, like much of the world outside of the US, could never work in reality. Suggesting it means you voted 100% for Trump or Stein, and if you say you didn’t you are lying. You can agree with them on damn near every social policy under the sun and provide metrics from progressive nations on their successes, and they’ll refuse to accept that anyone could possibly be more progressive than them, despite literal mountains of easily verifiable evidence.

I think unfortunately many people are just very politically ignorant and have no desire to even begin to question the US process or try anything different. The US is simply the best at everything. Europe and their crazy whacko ideas may as well be an alien planet and not worth thinking about.

Of course this isn’t all people, some shift is happening (as long as its not called socialism, generally), but in my personal experience leftist ideas pretty much get you locked out of any discussion. I typically get smug “Oh its so cute you’re in your socialist phase, you’ll grow out of it and understand politics like me” treatment.