The centrist voter is a myth. There is not a human who will vote for “means-tested subsidies for a state-run employer-funded health insurance marketplace where you have no idea what it will cover or cost.” But wouldn’t vote for “free healthcare” when you move to the center by compromising your bills, you lose voters who suspect the policy won’t help them, you dont gain a bunch of “moderate Republicans” who want only half of immigrants subjected to inhumane conditions.
I definitely don’t have it all figured out, but I wanna know do you ever think about stuff like what it took for the civil rights movement of the 1960s to succeed? Do you think it was a matter of pandering to the interests of centrist liberals or do you think that a big part of it was criticizing status quo liberalism and refusing to settle? I really think that you should read theletter from Birmingham jail by Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. because the archetype that he addresses in that work is replayed out every single time somebody ever deigns to criticize the Democrats for their political strategy.
The civil rights movement required a lot of people to go out and protest and do a lot. And in the “end” (i personally don’t think it is even over) the elected representatives VOTED for the civil rights act. But right now, people don’t vote because they don’t have their perfect candidate.
NOBODY is saying “don’t protest”, “don’t resist”, “don’t get out there and make a difference.” Hell i’ll join you, but GO FUCKING VOTE. Because if you don’t then only the people who vote have a voice.
In 2000 Al Gore ran on a platform to stronger focus on environmental protection, healthcare reform, and that he would “fight for the people, not the powerful.” He lost. After Obama we Voted for fucking Trump.
For the past 30 years Democrats move left and people don’t show up to vote. They didn’t vote for Gore, Hilary or Kamala instead they voted for the right. That is what America voted for. So that’s what we’re getting.
The fuck are you talking about? They did show up for Gore. He won the popular vote. The only reason Bush won was due to the electoral college flipping the vote. Gore’s election was stolen from him.
Democrats have not been moving left. They have consistently been moving further and further right since post-WW2 and McCarthyism completely demolished any legitimate left wing politics in this country. Meanwhile the voting population became more and more disenfranchised by the fucked up system we live under.
Between Nader and voters who didn’t turn out, it should have been a no-doubt winner. The game is set up a certain way, and unless you win elections, you can’t change the rules. Rs keep winning and they keep rigging it towards them. With almost 50% of eligible voters sitting out, only those who are playing get to win. If you’re suggesting revolution, we may get there someday, but I don’t think we’re there yet.
Except the person they were responding to phrased the situation poorly by leaving out important context.
In reality, the Democrats lost because they kept expecting leftists to vote against their working class interests in favor of right wing, pro corporate policies that only serve to maintain the capitalist system. You know, the very thing we are fundamentally against?
Maybe if the Democrats actually made strides for legitimate left wing policies, they would encourage more left wing individuals to throw their hat in with them.
Yet, time and time again, they have shown to throw the working class under the bus if it serves the whims of the capitalist market. Now, no one trusts them to uphold our interests when push comes to shove.
Funny of you to assume leftists want the neoliberal, capitalist establishment to win.
Maybe if they actually began to support left wing policy and ideology, instead of routinely throwing us under the bus to save the skin of those who exploit us, leftist would be willing to vote for them.
Also, FYI, there are more than just Democrats and Republicans to vote for. Saying people shouldn’t vote for Democrats isn’t the same thing as advocating against voting at all.
You’re not exactly wrong, but it’s even more fundamental than that. If leftists were a more reliable voting bloc, then Democrats couldn’t exist as they do today. They would be primaried by more leftist candidates. And then, if hard left policies were more popular with the general electorate, they would win.
The nightmare we’re all living in right now is proof. I don’t believe for an instant that The Powers That Be wanted Donald Trump to be president. Even by fascist standards he’s kind of a disaster. They wanted fucking Jeb! But Trump’s implicit message of “I’m going to fuck shit up and the establishment doesn’t want me” resonated with a lot of people. It just got the extra boost from being tied with fucked up racism, sexism, and ignorance, all of which are tied to pretty solid groups of voters.
The Democrats exist as they do now because they can’t rely on the left to vote. So they have to pander to the center.
The centrist voter is a myth. There is not a human who will vote for “means-tested subsidies for a state-run employer-funded health insurance marketplace where you have no idea what it will cover or cost.” But wouldn’t vote for “free healthcare” when you move to the center by compromising your bills, you lose voters who suspect the policy won’t help them, you dont gain a bunch of “moderate Republicans” who want only half of immigrants subjected to inhumane conditions.
Take a marketing class. If you think that politics is about pandering and not about convincing people, then you’ve lost the game already
Ah I understand now. You took Marketing 101 and have it all figured out.
I definitely don’t have it all figured out, but I wanna know do you ever think about stuff like what it took for the civil rights movement of the 1960s to succeed? Do you think it was a matter of pandering to the interests of centrist liberals or do you think that a big part of it was criticizing status quo liberalism and refusing to settle? I really think that you should read theletter from Birmingham jail by Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. because the archetype that he addresses in that work is replayed out every single time somebody ever deigns to criticize the Democrats for their political strategy.
The civil rights movement required a lot of people to go out and protest and do a lot. And in the “end” (i personally don’t think it is even over) the elected representatives VOTED for the civil rights act. But right now, people don’t vote because they don’t have their perfect candidate.
NOBODY is saying “don’t protest”, “don’t resist”, “don’t get out there and make a difference.” Hell i’ll join you, but GO FUCKING VOTE. Because if you don’t then only the people who vote have a voice.
In 2000 Al Gore ran on a platform to stronger focus on environmental protection, healthcare reform, and that he would “fight for the people, not the powerful.” He lost. After Obama we Voted for fucking Trump.
For the past 30 years Democrats move left and people don’t show up to vote. They didn’t vote for Gore, Hilary or Kamala instead they voted for the right. That is what America voted for. So that’s what we’re getting.
The fuck are you talking about? They did show up for Gore. He won the popular vote. The only reason Bush won was due to the electoral college flipping the vote. Gore’s election was stolen from him.
Democrats have not been moving left. They have consistently been moving further and further right since post-WW2 and McCarthyism completely demolished any legitimate left wing politics in this country. Meanwhile the voting population became more and more disenfranchised by the fucked up system we live under.
Between Nader and voters who didn’t turn out, it should have been a no-doubt winner. The game is set up a certain way, and unless you win elections, you can’t change the rules. Rs keep winning and they keep rigging it towards them. With almost 50% of eligible voters sitting out, only those who are playing get to win. If you’re suggesting revolution, we may get there someday, but I don’t think we’re there yet.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2000_United_States_presidential_election
gore won in Florida, too. the supreme Court stole the election for Bush.
Yes, we already lost last election because of the exact reasons stated by the person you’re responding to
Except the person they were responding to phrased the situation poorly by leaving out important context.
In reality, the Democrats lost because they kept expecting leftists to vote against their working class interests in favor of right wing, pro corporate policies that only serve to maintain the capitalist system. You know, the very thing we are fundamentally against?
Maybe if the Democrats actually made strides for legitimate left wing policies, they would encourage more left wing individuals to throw their hat in with them.
Yet, time and time again, they have shown to throw the working class under the bus if it serves the whims of the capitalist market. Now, no one trusts them to uphold our interests when push comes to shove.
Maybe if people like you stopped encouraging non voting we could win a fucking election
Funny of you to assume leftists want the neoliberal, capitalist establishment to win.
Maybe if they actually began to support left wing policy and ideology, instead of routinely throwing us under the bus to save the skin of those who exploit us, leftist would be willing to vote for them.
Also, FYI, there are more than just Democrats and Republicans to vote for. Saying people shouldn’t vote for Democrats isn’t the same thing as advocating against voting at all.
I assume you want Republicans to win, since it’s obvious to anyone your actions would lead to that.
Free to assume what you want. Not my fault your logic is simplistic and myopic.
Lololol says the person withholding their vote
You’re not exactly wrong, but it’s even more fundamental than that. If leftists were a more reliable voting bloc, then Democrats couldn’t exist as they do today. They would be primaried by more leftist candidates. And then, if hard left policies were more popular with the general electorate, they would win.
The nightmare we’re all living in right now is proof. I don’t believe for an instant that The Powers That Be wanted Donald Trump to be president. Even by fascist standards he’s kind of a disaster. They wanted fucking Jeb! But Trump’s implicit message of “I’m going to fuck shit up and the establishment doesn’t want me” resonated with a lot of people. It just got the extra boost from being tied with fucked up racism, sexism, and ignorance, all of which are tied to pretty solid groups of voters.